William St. John of Fonmon, Glamorgan
(-1305)

 

Family Links

Spouses/Children:
1. Unknown

William St. John of Fonmon, Glamorgan 1

  • Marriage (1): Unknown
  • Died: 1305

  General Notes:

The parentage of William is open to question.

The following three postings were copied from (SGM) soc.medieval.genealogy on google.com Groups:

-----------POSTING #1

Mardi Carter Feb 14 2002, 6:43 pm show options

Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
From: mardi... AT yahoo.com (Mardi Carter) - Find messages by this author
Date: 14 Feb 2002 15:43:43 -0800
Local: Thurs,Feb 14 2002 6:43 pm
Subject: St. John and Combmartin

I am revisiting the St. John family and am very confused as to the identity of the William St. John who m. Isabel Combmartin.
Unfortunately I only have access to secondary sources at this time and wondered if anyone has straightened them out.

1) William, of Fonmon (Faumont), Glamorgan, may have been son of Robert St. John, Lord of Basing. He may have been the unnamed son of Robert mentioned in the Close Rolls 1254-4 p 232 who d. 9 Mar 1254/4. The Close Rolls apparently do not name a wife, but the secondary sources say he m. Isabel Combmartin and had sons Henry d.s.p. and John. (Wotton's Baronetage 4:176-7; Brydges' Collins' Peerage 6:46; Berrys Hants p231; NEHGR 14:61; Wallop #860; Burke Ext. Peer. 1833 p 466; CP 11:323 note j)

2) William, of Plumpton, Northamptonshire, d. 4 Jul 1331 m. Isabel Combmartin who d. 1401. This William was son of another William of Plumpton who was living 1315. Isabel m. 2nd Richard de Rothing and 3rd John de Daventry. William and Isabel had a son Giles St. John.
(Baker's Northants 1:241, 2:96; Whalley's Bridge's Northants 1:323-4; Mis Gen Her 1:93)

Stoke-Bruere, Northants, descended from William Combmartin to his dau. Isabel, and to her granddaughter Margaret (dau. of Giles), wife of William Harrowden. (Whalley)

Plumpton came into the St. John family through the marriage of Sarah Plumpton to William St. John of Hameldon, Rutland, (d. by 1288) and descended to Sir John, William, William, Giles and to Giles' dau. Margaret, wife of William Harrowden. (Baker)

It seems to me that we probably have two Williams, one of whom m. Isabel Combmartin. If the descent of the manors is correct, it seems clear that Isabel was wife of William St. John of Plumpton and not the William of Fonmon. From the information at hand, I doubt that the two Williams were one person, but that is based only on intuition. The solution to these discrepancies is beyond the scope of my available sources. I will be grateful for any help.

Thanks. Mardi

-----------POSTING #2

Bob St. John Feb 14 2002, 9:00 pm show options

Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
From: "Bob St. John" - Find messages by this author
Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2002 01:59:49 GMT
Local: Thurs,Feb 14 2002 8:59 pm
Subject: Re: St. John and Combmartin

Might there have been two Isabel Cobmartins. One married William St. John in 1252 and the other married William, on Plumpton in the 1300's some time.

I have only secondary information but I have John's son john born 1255 so maybe he isn't the son of Robert who died in 1254. Robert's other son is apparently John who is listed on the Deering Rolls in 1270.

I am not claiming to have the answers you want, omnly a couple of suggestions.

-----------POSTING #3

Mardi Carter Feb 15 2002, 2:06 pm show options

Newsgroups: soc.genealogy.medieval
From: mardi... AT yahoo.com (Mardi Carter) - Find messages by this author
Date: 15 Feb 2002 11:06:10 -0800
Local: Fri,Feb 15 2002 2:06 pm
Subject: Re: St. John and Combmartin

Of course that is true, but I haven't seen two women of the same name with fathers of the same name marrying two men of the same name, but again, it is not impossible. There is a discrepancy in dates as far as the William St. Johns go, but then the date given by CP from the Close Rolls is not guaranteed to be that of a husband of an Isabel Combmartin. The father of Isabel who married into the Plumpton line was living in 1317 (Whalley) although in a plea roll it says he died temp. Edw I. The only date that I can find that firmly attaches to William of Fonmon is temp. Edw. I. The Plumpton William St John d. 1331. It seems that they were all living about the same time.

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William married.


Sources


1 William Harvey, Robert Cooke, George Owen, Sir Richard Saint-George, <i>The Visitations of Bedfordshire: Annis Dominis 1566, 1582 and 1634</i> (London, The Harleian Society, 1884), p. 51.

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